A correspondence about
MEMORY and &&&

context:
This page continues a MailList thread initiated by a question
regarding the place of Zarathustra/Zorastre beside HAMOO identity
(in blue my correspondents - this color, myself)

LIST of the MESSAGES

• 1) An opinion - about the qualities of Monotheist claims

• 2) Answer - the Plural conclusion of a Science of Monotheism
  

Abstract

If we consider the Akhnaton-Oedipus (with many scholars today) - 'Oedipus philosopher' must thus reflect/consider a layer as 'Akhnaton philosopher' - and therefore bring to his foundation the monotheism which is 'similar to Zurvanism' (according to Kent). The Moses'stage (according to other scholars) gives an interesting description of this complex process. If this triple phase is not admitted - thus Trismegistus will continue to be repressed, and the Inquisition to block the ecological project of his Alchemy.

I researched Zorasterism fairly thouroughly at one point. I mention some results of that in my book THE FRAGMENTATION OF BEING AND THE PATH BEYOND THE VOID. From what I could put together it is clear that Zoraster was a standard Monotheistic Prophet to the Indo-Europeans who confronted the worshipers of Indra who supplanted Mitra/Varuna which are both mentioned in the Vedas. The Vedas record the supplanting process. In my estimation Mitra/Varuna were Angels and Indra is a Jinn as is made clear by the distinctions made in the Vedas between the two classes of dieties and the changing meaning of those class terms over time. It is unclear what Zoraster took issue with but we do know it has something to do with the treatment of Cattle, perhaps their sacrifice.

What happened is that the followers of Zarathustra went back to worshiping Varuna and called him WISE LORD perhaps confusing that Angel  -with the Monotheistic God. Mitra became a lower level diety instead of a twin of Varuna and surfaced later in Mitrism which is the basis of Christianity. The monotheism degenerated into a radical dualism that mirrored the production of nihilistic opposites in Western Culture which is the dominate stucture of manifestation. Eventually it was realized that this radical dualism of too light too dark dieties in eternal war was flawed theologically and the cult of Zurvan attempted to rectify the theorlogy by forging an artifical monotheism again. The worship of Zurvan is seen again in Mitrism in the statues of the god Aion and is also related to Kronos as a God of Time. What is weird is that this eater of children eventually became Santa Claus. He used to carry away children in the bag instead of delivering toys. The cult of Zurvan is the most interesting thing in Zorasterism as far as I could tell beause it grew up when it was realized that the two twin sons must have a father. This however is radically different from a monotheistic God that does not beget and is not begotton and has no equal. Unlike the Hebrews the Indo-europeans did not have a tradition of monotheism to fall back on to preserve the tradition of one God. Thus it degenerated very quickly back into a model of their social cast system similar to what we see in Vedas.

However the Zorastrian pantheon is much more superficial than the Vedic Pantheon, so in effect a lot of cultural structure was lost. However as Dumazile points out we can still see the tructuring of the Pantheon on the Indoeuropean model even in Zorastrianism.

The influence of Zorastrianism on the Greeks was profound. Almost all Greek philosophy is a reaction to and a modeling of the radical dualisms that we see in Zorastianism. Those radical dualisms I call Nihilistic Distinctions the production of which is the main thing that the Western Worldivew is concerned with. Mot of the books about Zorastrian infulunce on the Greeks are very poor and a lot of work needs to be done on this from a cultural/historical viewpoint. But the Greek islands were just a backwater to the Persian empire where radical dualism and fire worship were a norm.

Getting back to the monotheistic roots of Zorastrianism is nearly impossible because the texts themselves are so corrupt. They were obviously rewritten several times to make the dualistic character of the religion legitimate and so it is just about impossible to discern the monotheistic strata of the documents. It would be very interesting to know exactly what the contents of the monotheistic revelation to the Indo-europeans really was.

Fundamentally Western Culture is Zoroastrian even today in the sense that the main work of the worldview is still the production of radical dualisms. Everytime we watch a movie about the Good Guys vs the Bad Guys we are back in the Zorastrian Groove. We sprinkle in Romantic love which comes from Manichism (a Zoroastrian Heresy) and Catharism for good measure. (Cf COMING TO OUR SENSES by Morris Berman).

Jung reserects the God Aion (Zurvan, Kronos) as his Symbol of the Self.

Jung also mentions at one point that traditionally the White Magicians wear black cloths and the Black Magicians wear white clothes. If you take this to heart the it becomes clear that the Good Guys in our movies are perhaps really evil and the Bad Guys are perhaps something different than they are portrayed as. This simple rule allows us to decode the nihilistic dualisms and see that the portrayal of the Indians, for instance, is a fundamental distortion. Seeing the evil in ourselves is a fundamental theme of my book THE FRAGMENTATION OF BEING AND THE PATH BEYOND THE VOID. The Indo-europeans are the destroyers of the earth. We are they, even if our ancestry is not Indo-european because this Zorastrian worldview has achieved Global Domination. Nietzsche realized this and thus wrote THUS SPAKE  ZARATHUSTRA. The first chapter of my book is a commentary on a section of Nietzsche's masterwork.

My book is available at:
http://dialog.net:85/homepage/apeiron.htm

The way in which Theaux's identification of Moses, Akhnaton and Oedipus is interesting is that there is a fundmental confrontation between the Zorastrian Western Worldview and the Monotheism that is prophetically based. Theaux picks figures that are fundamental in this struggle.

Moses confronted the Pharoah, the polytheistic magician. Moses as we see in Quran was a real prophet of a Monotheistic God.

Akhnaton is a Pharoah that perhaps subscribed to Monotheism but in the process subverted it from its prophetic origins {I, WT, underline}. Thus Akhnaton's monotheism is similar to Zurvanism, i.e. as a artificial monotheism layed over a polytheistic base .

Oedipus was the first philosopher as shown by Gaux. The philosopher is the one who fails the initiation ceremony of the Indo-european Hero. I talk about this initiation ceremony in detail in my book where I attempt an archeology of it as the dynamic underlying the static structure of the Indo-european city.

Philosophers are caught in this maze between true revelation lost and artificial attempts to reconstruct monotheism {I, WT, underline} that always go wrong. We must always attempt ot go back to the sources of true revelation from the monotheistic god and compare those to the artificial images built up by theology that arise out of dualism and attempt to regain those sources.

This attempt leads us to the contemplation of the relation between super-rationality and paradoxicality. In Islam we see for instance an entire sharia made up of super-rational practices along with a Quran that  is uncreated (what ever that means). However thre is one dot of paradoxicality in the story in the Sura of the Cave where Kither kills the child. This story fufills all the prerequsites of the absurd that Kierkeegard lays out. In fact there is just enough information given to make it absurd. So there is one dot of absurdity in the midst of a sea of superrationality.

Similarly in the Western Tradition which generates paradoxicality like mad because of the assumption of excluded middle following the direction of Aristotle there are always hints of superrationality, see Blyth's collectio of Koan like statements from the literature of the Western tradition.

When we realize that the Islamic Worldivew has been destroyed and subsumed under WEstern Domination like the Chinese Worldview along with many others that have been destroyed by Colonialization then we see the Super-rational embedded in the Paradoxical. When we realize that there has been 124000 prophets {I, perplexed WT, underline} and that everything that the Western Worldview claims as its own is probably the result of prophetic revelation at some point in human history then we see the paradoxical embedded in the super-rational.

We are the ones who live inside this Koan which defines the world at its present state. It is the role of the Philosopher to contemplate this connundrum. Like the question of the Sphynx that Odepipus grappled with in our own case the answer is our selves. Jung defines our selves as the God Aion (Zurvan), this definition is very similar in structure to the Emergent Meta-system (Self Generating System) Cycle. This shows the deep roots of our subject of study. The EMS cycle has been described by me as the interface between Form and Formlessness but perhaps it can also be described as the interface between paradoxicality and super-rationality.

Thus it is an image of prediciment of the failed inductee of the Heroic initiation.

Kent

Monotheisms and Oedipus the philosopher

The Zorastre thread has been stimulating. It has raised a most interesting point through the question of the philosopher.

The philosopher, Oedipus, would be a wanderer, between the loss (of the true Initiation) and the fake (in a remake of Initiation). As Lacan, rounding to this category, the philosopher would incarnate the failure to recover with the fake, the forever lost.

By chance, some gnosis, may eventually blend with the Western Industry - this being possible if the identification of the Triple Master would restore a Western identity.
This may be the luck of the Philosopher [aka Oedipus] who is seeking  (Re: above) his path in the failure in the crack between Monotheism in Truth [aka Moses] and in subversion [aka Akhnaton]. This is inviting a note :

If Oedipus (the philosopher) is looking for Truth, he will not contradict Akhnaton becoming a philosopher (if not a prophet). Akhnaton the Zorastre could have undergone the Heroic Initiation (leaving BTW, to Ramses the artificial attempt to reconstruct which horrifies the philosopher).

I have developed this prospect in two considerations: one, regarding Freud's Oedipus Complex and his failure .
The other one regards the initiation of the philosopher in the Scientific process (Psychoanalysis) .
Another page regards the 'esoteric' understanding of the initiation process. It is of interest in this matter for during a long time this initiation process has been under the sole 'esoteric' control (that causing its falsification) .

The obvious opposition at this point, between the above academic view (regarding the Bad Guy - Akhnaton - and the Good Guy - Moses - with the Third Guy - the philosopher) and mine (who counts four with Hermes Trismegistus or Oedipus/Orpheus), incite sme to make another notice regarding our present catastrophic/apocalyptic situation.

Since Western Heros like Koans, here is one coming from conclusion : the good guy was saying that hell was not a necessity, quite an illusion. The bad guy said : you need the proof that hell exists, and he smashed his face .

There is no failure in our Initiation but the one the Initiate chose to create.
Ability for choice is a major aspect of the Western Initiation.

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